Redevelopment would result
in net loss of affordable units
Brown Development unveiled plans for its massive redevelopment proposal for properties it owns along Battery Lane in Bethesda at a required public meeting last night. While the plans are controversial, the meeting was much less heated than many anticipated. But the total number of affordable units are also less than some had predicted, leaving a net loss of such units on one of the few streets in downtown Bethesda that has naturally-occurring affordable apartments.
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Lots A,B,C,D and E that hold the
six properties targeted for
redevelopment |
Attorney Nancy Regelin led the meeting, which lasted for over two hours. She said Brown intends to file a preliminary plan and sketch plan with Montgomery County in April. Six buildings in total on Battery would be demolished if the County approves the plans. While the developer is filing plans for all six properties together in order to present a coherent vision, Regelin said the redevelopment will play out over a ten to fifteen year period.
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A microphone awaits public
comments at Imagination Stage
last night |
A site plan would not likely be approved before 2020, Regelin predicted. Groundbreaking for Phase 1 would be expected in 2021.
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Illustrative plan showing the
layout and landscaping for the
redeveloped properties |
"We don't want to talk about a project, but a place," Aldon Properties Executive Vice-President Douglas M. Wrenn told the audience. Aldon is a subsidiary of Brown. Wrenn said that maintaining the existing buildings has become more of a challenge in the last fifteen years, although some current Battery Lane residents tell me they find conditions more than acceptable. Claiming net operating income is shrinking, Wrenn argued redevelopment is necessary to retain value in the properties while providing better housing for Bethesda residents.
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| Site A - 4857 Battery Lane |
Wrenn promised 25% MPDUs, and went further to make an unusual promise of "workforce housing" that would be constructed with cheaper materials for those who don't qualify for MPDUs. However, even at 25%, the redevelopment will end with a net loss of affordable units on Battery Lane.
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| Site B - 4858 Battery Lane |
There are 477 naturally-occurring affordable units on the Brown properties along Battery today. Brown is proposing to build a total of 1498 new units. But at 25%, that would result in a net loss of affordable units. There is no guarantee or requirement that Brown actually build the "workforce housing" units is alluded to beyond the MPDUs.
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| Site C - 4890, 4900 Battery Lane |
Such midrange units, to my knowledge, have never been built and marketed anywhere in Montgomery County. Advertising housing built with lower-quality materials is certainly unusual, as well. If there is a market for this, no private developer in its own private project has so far attempted to serve it. It will be interesting to see if the Planning Board actually makes these additional workforce units mandatory, and if they end up not getting flipped to more luxury units by the time they are built.
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Landscaping plan for Site D
4949 Battery Lane |
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Massing diagram for Site D
4949 Battery Lane |
Residents attending the meeting were not satisfied with having a net loss of affordable housing on Battery. It's also notable that many who currently live in the naturally-occurring affordable units on Battery today will not qualify for MPDUs - they make too much money, but not enough to afford the market rate at newer buildings in town. That is why you rarely hear about "workforce housing" in relation to MPDUs anymore. While MPDUs were once hailed as "workforce housing" for government employees held in the highest public esteem, many Montgomery County police officers, firefighters and teachers actually earn too much to qualify for them.
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Height study for Site E
4998 Battery Lane |
Many attendees had practical concerns about the project, as well. One resident of an existing Brown/Aldon building asked if he should rent a P.O. Box now for his mail. A neighbor who owns a house by the Stonehall condos said she will need continued access to the alley behind Stonehall because she has no access to her property from Woodmont.
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| Site E - 4998 Battery Lane |
Another homeowner at the intersection of Battery and Old Georgetown Road asked if Brown could assist in making that intersection safer, reporting that she sees many accidents there. She also expressed concern that such a high number of units will threaten her business of renting homes to NIH employees. I can suggest she has nothing to worry about, as prices and rents have only increased as thousands of new apartments and condos have been delivered in downtown Bethesda. It's unlikely her current tenants qualify for MPDUs, either.
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Study of impact of new building
at Site E on nearby single-family home |
Finally, condo owners at Whitehall were concerned about sunlight to their property being blocked. They are not only afraid they won't get as much natural light, but that the valuable trees on their property will fall ill or die without sufficient sun.
While approval is nearly certain before the developer-controlled Planning Board, public approval is still important, especially since Brown emphasized its plan to remain part of the community as a long-term owner. Amenities will play a key role. Wrenn pointed to a pedestrian cut-through to the new development from Rugby Avenue and an events space near the Whitehall property as two potential public amenities. But if MPDUs or mandatory mid-priced units can be bumped up to at least the number there today, public acceptance would most certainly be broader.
54 comments:
A nice report on the meeting. Thanks!
I see that the zoning allows 120’ on most of these parcels, and not all of the parcels are maxed out, which is admirable. They do show one parcel with 180’ tall buildings, near the White Hall and NIH. How can the get approval for 60’ additional feet? I thought that the maximum additional height that is allowed if they provide more than the required 15% MPDU’s was 2 stories and 24’.
Any discussion about why there is not even a token amount of retail, especially along the building that fronts on Woodmont, across from the Stonehall project and kitty corner from Harris Teeter? I thought Woodmont was supposed to be a canopy corridor and include retail in the base.
As some of the rents in these existing apartments are likely the lowest in downtown, I would think they are already similar to workforce housing. Even though the might have fewer total affordable (MPDU + Workforce) housing, I wonder if they net total affordable rents will be at or below what already exists. I agree that the MDPU’s only help with the lowest income bracket, but I thought they were maintaining two existing buildings that currently offer what might be considered workforce housing.
Robbie, you were not sitting at the vantage point from where these photos were taken. In fact, you could not be seen anywhere during the presentation, during the question and answer session, or in the one-on-one discussions before and after. Who was the uncredited flunkie who did your work for you last night?
6:42: Not surprised you were disoriented, given you were so busy quaking in your boots hiding from me last night. Tough guy behind a screen, girly man in person. Your testosterone level is the only number lower than your IQ. Man up.
I, and I don't think I am alone, have never heard of "naturally occurring affordable housing". Would you care to explain this non-development, non-planning phrase? It's the weirdest, most awkward phrase I've ever heard.
I would offer some context on the discussion of replacing all of the potentially lost Battery Lane apartments with MPDUs. The current monthly rent for a 1 bedroom MPDU in Bethesda is around $1300 (source: Mont Co website). The current monthly rent listed by Aldon for available 1 BR apartments on Battery Lane is around $1600-1700 (source: Aldon website), though I presume current tenants may be paying somewhat less. So you can draw your own conclusions as to the impact on tenants and landlords of converting all of the lost Battery Lane apartments to MPDUs.
By the way, the upper income limit (gross income) for a family of two who wants to rent an MPDU is $61,000 for a low-rise apartment and $65,500 for a high-rise apartment (souce: Mont Co website). These limits are based on average incomes in the entire DC Metropolitan Statistical Area, not just Montgomery County. The minimum income for eligibility to rent an MPDU is $30,000, but each individual rental facility can adjust this figure up or down somewhat based on the actual amount of MPDU rent and the individual renter's creditworthiness - the issue is whether the MPDU renter can and will pay the MPDU rent. How many current Battery Lane residents could meet these MPDU criteria is unknown.
I think that the reference in the article to use of "lower quality" materials may be a little misleading. As I interpreted what the speaker was saying, he was talking about "lower cost" rather than "lower quality". For example, the speaker indicated that construction costs would be lower for their mid-rise buildings than for typical Bethesda high-rise buildings simply because of the difference in size and consequent construction design, not necessarily materials per se. In addition, outfitting a kitchen with something less than the over-the-top high-end cabinets and appliances typical in these new Bethesda luxury high rises could hardly be said to be of lower quality; they may not have gold handles, but that doesn't mean the quality is low.
"Virginia officials say no thanks to Elon Musk
"A group of Virginia transportation officials toured Elon Musk’s “Boring Company” tunnel and found it, well, boring and not ready to replace existing transportation. “It’s a car in a very small tunnel,” one said."
@7:31. So you atttended the meeting. Who cares? Make an informative comment or STFU.
I still don’t know how they plan to get 180’ and 160’ high towers approved where only 120’ + 24’ 25% MPDU Credit = 144’ is allowed. To my knowledge, multiple unused building heights can not be aggregated to allow higher than 120’ + 24’ = 144’ on any one site. I supposed a zoning variance could be granted or a Planned Unit Developemt (PUD) could be approved.
I do like the idea of taller landmark towers on Parcel D adjacent to the enhanced Bethesda Trolley Trail and close to NIH. This could frame a nice pedestrian gateway from NIH to the Bethesda CBD, and might justify aggregated building height.
I also like how the have proposed a privately owned public space on the Trolley Trail opposite the nice new outdoor plaza area at Sunrise Senior Housing. This would create an attractive node on the trail. The amphitheater idea is cool, with terraces seating to conceal the one level of above grade parking. This could be a nice little plaza area, flanked by one existing and three new towers. This would be an ideal location for a small neighborhood cafe/coffee shop/ market. Being so close to NIH might even draw some employees to the plaza for lunch. I would imagine all of these new buildings will be heavily targeted to NIH employees.1000 more apartments on the north edge of the Woodmont Triangle will really help those commercial spaces.
At the meeting, did they mention if they will be placing the utilities underground on Battery Lane? The overhead lines, utility poles and transformers are rather nasty along the street. Multiple land owners would need to share the cost, and some don’t seem to be planning any remodeling or new development. I hope Aldon will step up and do this as the move from east to west.
The existing sidewalks are extremely narrow, and enhanced sidewalks would be very welcome.
I think the developer intends to use durable but less luxurious (but not low quality) materials on the MPDU and Workforce Housing Units. This would likely mean laminate counters instead of stone, enamel appliances instead of stainless steel, painted drywall back splashes instead of glass tiles, all tub/showers instead of a mix of tubs and glass showers, 8’ ceilings instead of 9’, carpet instead of hardwood floors, fewer balconies and smaller windows. These could still be very nice, but could be more moderately priced. Maybe fewer amenities, and less covered parking in the more affordable buildings would keep the rent down as well.
I look forward to seeing how the elevations are developed on the buildings. All three architects have some great looking projects on their websites. It’s nice that Aldon is using multiple firms to create variety. The new towers will certainly be more dynamic than the existing and very boring brick low-rises.
I did a little research, and found this on Naturally Occuring Affordable Housing (NOAH). I thought Robert was making this up, but it isifact a real term. Sorry I doubted you Robert!
AN UNRECOGNIZED RESOURCE
A majority of America’s affordable housing operates without subsidy and is referred to as Naturally Occurring Affordable Housing (NOAH). These Class B and Class C multifamily rental properties (generally built between 1940 to 1990) provide housing at rates affordable to low- and moderate-income households.
Often located close to good schools, well-paying jobs, parks, and other amenities, NOAH properties are ideal workforce housing. However, many suffer from poor upkeep and neglectful management, making them unappealing, unfit and unsafe for occupation.
PRESERVATION & STABILIZATION
The demand for NOAH remains strong in a housing market with record low vacancy rates. In fact, with ever-growing demand for rental housing, many NOAH properties are under threat of conversion to market-rate, luxury units. This puts families and communities at risk for displacement.
NOAH ADVANTAGES
The approach has numerous advantages to traditional heavily subsidized new-construction projects:
It keeps families and communities intact and in their existing homes.
It improves the lives of people who live in substandard, Class B and C properties through rehabilitation, improved management, and a long-term commitment to affordability.
Properties are placed back in service within a relatively short timeframe (generally 12–18 months).
The total project costs are much lower, making the funding easier to assemble and the predevelopment period much shorter.
Pre-development requires a fraction of the time devoted to LIHTC projects and is completed in a few months.
I found this approved amendment to the MoCo height regulations regarding MPDU’s:
‘The floor area counted as MPDU floor area includes a proportional share of the gross floor area not devoted to residential units.
The height limit of the applicable zone and master plan does not apply to the extent required to provide the MPDUs. The additional height is calculated as the floor area provided for MPDUs above 12.5% divided by the average residential floor plate area, where each whole number and each remaining fraction allows an increase of 12 feet.”
So apprently, the height can be increased by more than 24’’ dependent on the amount out MPDU’s above 12.5%. I guess that why a 25% MPDU building can add 60’ of height. Does this mean that a 100% MPDU building could add 180’ to the 120’ height and be 300’ tall? Obviously unlikely for a developer to build that much affordable hoising, but perhaps the HOC?
the moco planning board is corrupt. Keep building the high rises that have destroyed Bethesda. Ballston without the tax breaks
We're you seated in the front row Dyer with all those Whitehall women to get those close-up pics?
They honestly should have built the maximum height on all the properties.
The more affordable housing available in this location, the better.
I'm sure the Battery Park house owners weren't happy when the two Whitehall towers when up decades ago. Folks will get over this too.
I love that Dyer has illustrations that bring the project to life.
It seems like every morning I get up and Robert Dyer is reporting on a new development.
I'm detecting some jealously about Dyer's report. It's being widely read around town, lots of comments and has illustrations and photos from the actual meeting.
Robert knows the history of the area and can put a story into context.
Thanks to Dyer's comment massacre of a few minutes ago, there are now only half the number of comments here than on BB's article.
Indeed, Roald! Dyer does report on new development nearly every day. Doesn’t exactly jive with the whole “moribund” narrative though, does it?
"It seems like every morning I get up", writes "Roald" at 4:44 PM. LOL
The reason for 25% MPDUs: NO Impact Taxes! No School Impact Tax or Transportation Impact Tax on the full project, i.e. both the MPDUs AND the market-rate units.
This is quite a savings for the developer. When added to the "Bonus Density" available for 25% MPDUs it is a win for the developer and a loss for the County coffers. These policies are the legacy of Nancy Floreen.
Yeah, let's just replace all of our obsolete housing with luxury apartments, only.
8:16: Another such developer tax cut is about to be approved by the "new" County Council. Imagine that - a tax cut for developers, and a tax increase for you, the taxpayer.
7:44: It "jives" perfectly, because building residential housing is a very tiny part of economic development. This is why the County's revenue is so low - it's all dependent on residential housing (property taxes) and income taxes.
While mid-rise and high-rise residential multi family buildings do not directly create new office jobs, they do create real estate property tax income for the county, hundreds of construction jobs, management jobs, maintenance jobs and design/engineering jobs. Most new mid and high rise residential construction in Bethesda includes park and school impact taxes that help fund civic improvements.This building type has much lower student age residents, and therefore creates reduced impact on schools, compared to single family and garden style apartments. Being located near transit, they greatly reduce the impact on traffic and roads as more and more folks use their cars less and less.
The biggest impact on job growth is the fact that dense urban development creates a need for new and improved businesses like retail, restaurants and cafes, all supported by new residents. Dense urban residential creates walkable streetscapes that entices large corporations to move to, or at least stay in urban areas. Luxury apartments and condos are mostly occupied by folks that have disposable income to support these new and existing businesses. They have guests that visit and stay in many of the area hotels on weekends that supplant business hotel patrons.
Marriott, Clark, JBG Smith, Host Hotels, Fox 5 News, and many other business move (or stay) in Bethesda because of the combination of dense, walkable area, a large part of which consists of mid and high rise residential. The new Battery Lane towers will certainly help support new businesses, research and office expansion at NIH by providing walkable housing options. The more folks that live close together in desireable dense urban areas, the more likely it will be that corporations will choose to move to a city. The age of the large suburban office park is dead.
5:58: The suburban office park is alive and well. In fact, many of the most powerful companies in the world like Apple, Google, and Facebook have actively chosen suburban office park sites for their headquarters.
I've debunked the revenue argument many times, but again, we've confirmed in Montgomery County that the revenue generated by residential housing does not exceed the costs it generates. After two decades of massive construction countywide, the County is in the red year after year with a structural budget deficit.
Likewise, the huge backlog of unbuilt school and transportation infrastructure has NOT been fully funded by the school fees and impact taxes. It's not even close.
The claim that denser housing generates fewer students is also a verified myth. Over 50% of BCC High School students live in apartment buildings. The generation rate is even higher in the Whitman district, which is where the Westbard students will go. Montgomery County recently admitted that townhomes have now exceeded single-family homes as having a higher student generation rate. Along with massive immigration, these facts explain the exploding MCPS population.
Marriott and JBG are largely here because they are left-wing companies that align politically with the Berzerkley, CA-inspired elected officials of MoCo. Fox 5 is probably here because office space is cheaper than in the more-desirable District, much as with WTOP. The areas around the future Marriott and JBG HQs are dead, dead, dead after 9 PM or so, hardly the vibrant nightlife millennial employees want.
"Over 50% of BCC High School students live in apartment buildings. The generation rate is even higher in the Whitman district...Montgomery County recently admitted that townhomes have now exceeded single-family homes as having a higher student generation rate"
Robbie, I understand that you attended Catholic school. Perhaps it is possible that you still don't know how babies are made?
"Marriott and JBG are largely here because they are left-wing companies that align politically with the Berzerkley, CA-inspired elected officials of MoCo."
Jeez, Dyer. You are fucking loon. Please get help before your trust fund runs out.
7:05: No clue what you're talking about. What does "how babies are made" have to do with student generation rates in apartments and townhomes?
7:18: Both Marriott and JBG are on the record strongly supporting radical, Berzerkley-style Democrat elected officials in Montgomery County, and do not support pro-business Republican candidates. These matters of public record, as embarrassing as they are, are what are referred to as "facts." Try using them sometime.
The Republican candidates are idiots who, with the exception of Robin Ficker, didn't even bother to campaign.
The MoCo GOP didn't have competitive primaries and they didn't field any candidates for three of the five Council districts. Same bunch of rejects every four years.
11:13am Why were there no at large Council debates last cycle? We had a full competitive of candidates and open seats.
@ 11:46 AM - Why are you asking the question that was just answered in @ 11:13 AM?
Directly from the 2019 Montgomery School Test Presentation:
• On average across the county, each multifamily high rise unit generates 0.072 elementary school students.
...100 multifamily high rise units generate 7.2 elementary students. ...1,000 multifamily high rise units generate 72 elementary students.
• Very important to know that this is not an estimate. These are as close to capturing reality, for the given geography and housing type, as possible. We were able to match 99.1% of the 159,000+ MCPS students to a housing type!
This means that for the entire 10-15 year build out of the Battery Lane Project, which will add 1021 net new high rise multi family units, only 74 new elementary students will be added to the system, or about 2 classrooms.
Not as many babies are made by people living in mid and high rise apartments and condos, compared to single family houses and garden style apartments.
You overestimate the impact of high rise residential on school overcrowding.
The complete presentation:
https://montgomeryplanning.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/20180621AnnualSchoolTestPBPres.pdf
Before you bring up all the townhouses proposed at Westbard, this discussion is about the new mid and high rises proposed at long Battery Lane.
@ 1:39 PM - Dyer will respond by saying "you're wrong you're wrong you're wrong", stomp his foot, but give no numbers of his own.
Saith Dyer: "Wrenn promised 25% MPDUs, and went further to make an unusual promise of "workforce housing'."
Robbie, it's odd that you are pretending not to know about Montgomery County's Workforce Housing program. It already exists at several properties, including the Darcy and the Flats in Bethesda Row. You even mentioned in at least two of your articles about Westbard, including this comment here:
http://robertdyer.blogspot.com/2016/03/westbard-land-use-staff-report-reflects.html?showComment=1457405435876#c5045958739203929676
"Unemployed parent with two kids getting free, new luxury apartment in Germantown with giant screen TV and Olympic size pool is not 'workforce housing' for 'police officers and teachers'. I've encountered people in downtown Bethesda who say they live in the Metropolitan who are clearly psychiatric patients who would otherwise be homeless. There are a variety of clientele who end up in these 'workforce' units. Don't believe the hype. Ask the folks in Twinbrook Forest how it was when the methadone clinic was there. Scary stuff."
On that same thread:
RD: "If development proceeds [in Westbard] under the current recommendations of the Planning Board and Council staff, there will be a large influx of low-income children into this 2 block area."
Anon: "This 2 block area" No, it's not. Quit lying.
RD: You're the one who's lying. All of the development is within the range of two city blocks, along Westbard Avenue, Ridgefield Road and River Road. On Westbard, it doesn't even cover the whole block between Ridgefield and Massachusetts Avenue, and it's a very short block of Ridgefield that's in the plan area. 2 blocks.
Anon: "The whole block between Ridgefield and Massachusetts" More hilarious distortion by Dyer. A "block" equals between one-twentieth and one-eighth of a mile, not an entire mile.
RD: What do you have to smoke to reach the conclusion that Westbard Avenue is a mile long between Ridgefield and Massachusetts? Whatever it is, George Leventhal wants to legalize it. Your math is not even close on this.
Anon: So what is the distance, Dyer? Google Maps says that it is 1.1 miles. If it's not that, then it must be some other number. You can't just reflexively say "you're wrong" and then not give an alternate answer.
11:13: You're a liar, and a moron. The people who saw me campaigning at events and parades countywide are laughing at you right now. Your bosses at the Montgomery County cartel colluded with the Washington Post & other local media and community organizations to block all coverage of my campaign, and to cancel all general election debates. Come at me bro - they'll haul you away in a garbage truck, which is why you're always hiding at the events you claim to be stalking me at.
Having a Soviet-style election every four years doesn't make the non-cartel candidates "rejects." It's the crooks who can win only through voter fraud and collusion who are the ultimate losers.
1:39: Hysterical quote - "as close to capturing reality..." Is this the same MCPS that has chronically underestimated student population for two decades?
The planning department keeps jabbering, but in reality there are MORE PORTABLES THAN EVER at MCPS schools. They couldn't "capture reality" in a wet paper bag if you handed it to them.
Those numbers are dead wrong - over 50% of BCC students live in apartments. That is a real number. Facts.
3:32: Dummie...the Battery Lane plan is not formally participating in any County "workforce housing" program. In fact, they are making no binding commitment at all.
The comments you cite were a response to someone (probably you) referring to the low-income housing proposed for Westbard as "workforce housing," by claiming that the people in the MPDUs would be employed, middle-class workers. You were wrong all the way around, and now you're wrong again on Battery.
3:45: All those quotes just make you look like an idiot. You do realize you just quoted yourself saying the distance along Westbard between Ridgefield and Massachusetts is 1.1 miles? Hilarious exaggeration. You're obviously not the sharpest tool in the drawer, but you are a tool.
“All cruelty springs from weakness.”
~ Seneca
"You do realize you just quoted yourself saying the distance along Westbard between Ridgefield and Massachusetts is 1.1 miles? Hilarious exaggeration. You're obviously not the sharpest tool in the drawer, but you are a tool."
Google Maps says that the distance is 1.1 miles.
What do you say that the distance is, Robbie?
At the meeting Thursday night, the Brown Development team specifically mentioned that there are many children living at the current apartments. He said we all see the large groups waiting for the school bus.
So it's reasonable to expect many more children in the new battery Lane apartments.
Saith Dyer: "they'll haul you away in a garbage truck"
Screenshot taken, forwarded to the FBI.
10:17 AM
Four story high low to mid-rise apartments generate about 3 times the amount of K-12 students as 7 to 18 story high high rise apartments, at least according to the Montgomery County School Test. Almost all of the new buildings proposed at Battery Lane would be considered high rise.
Only 139 K-12 students per 1000 apartments for low to higrise apartments, compared to 408 K-12 students per 1000 low to mid-rise apartment. Again, high rise is anything above 75’ from the lowest area where fire truck fight a fire from, so about 7 stories.
It’s all outlined in the 2019 School Test
http://montgomeryplanning.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/20180621AnnualSchoolTestPBPres.pdf
9:34: It's less than 1.1 miles, that's for sure.
3:25: Aside from the fact that the planning department and MCPS numbers are notoriously falsely low, a majority of the new Battery buildings will be mid-rise.
"It's less than 1.1 miles, that's for sure."
If you're so sure, then why can't you provide an alternate number?
"A majority of the new Battery buildings will be mid-rise."
Wrong again. Site "E" is proposed to be 6 stories/70 feet. All the rest are proposed to be 9 to 17 stories.
5:38: I've run a mile in gym class, and have walked Westbard Avenue thousands of times - it is not even a mile, much less 1.1 miles.
If you look at the renderings in my Battery Lane District article, you will see most are mid-rise.
For a so called reporter, you sure have a hard time with facts.
The developers summary clearly shows that almost 90% of the new apartments in Battery Lane will be considered high rise construction, being over 75’ tall, according to the definition of high rise construction by the International Building Code (IBC), the specific building code that Montgomery County (and most of the world) uses to define construction typology.
The 2019 School Test clearly shows that very few students live in high rises, compared to single family detached, attached, and low to mid rise apartments. Only about 139 K-12 students per 1000 high-rise units compared to 408 to 465 K-12 students per 1000 in SFD, SFA, low and mid-rise multi family apartments.
Site A is 86’ tall and 110 units, Site B is 160’ tall and 400 units, Site C is 120’ and 315 units and Site D is 180’ tall and 520 units. Only Site E is not considered high rise, at 70’ tall and 153 units. That’s 1345 high rise units out of 1498 total units or 89.8 %.
Here is the data from the developer;
https://montgomeryplanning.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/03/Battery-Lane-District_8_Additonal-Submission-Files.pdf
You still disagree that Montgomery County has incorrectly calculated the type of housing that students live in? They claim a 99.1% percent accuracy in their 2019 School Test. You believe that the Planning and specifically the school system “notoriously falsely” report their data to reduce the apparent need to build more schools. Why would the school system intentionally report false data to keep schools from expanding and improving. This makes absolutely no sense. It would be int heir best interest to show the need for more schools, not try to cover up or under-report this requirement.
Perhaps you need another layer of tin foil on your conspiracy protection hat.
"I've run a mile in gym class"
LOL. I'll bet that was the worst day of your life.
"...and have walked Westbard Avenue thousands of times - it is not even a mile, much less 1.1 miles."
So how long is it? How do you know that it is not 1.1 miles if you don't have an actual number yourself? Are you unable to use Google or Bing Maps? Does your car not have a trip odometer?
6:06: It's you - and the County government - who have a hard time with facts. If you really believe their cooked numbers are 99.1% (Good Lord - insert uncontrollable guffaws here) accurate, how do you explain that they have been dead wrong about projected enrollments in MCPS for the last couple of decades? Why is the number of portables at MCPS at an ALL TIME HIGH?
Nobody with any common sense believes student generation numbers provided by the County anymore.
The school system is political just like the rest of the government, which is controlled by the Montgomery County cartel. The County went to extreme lengths to cook the books to magically make it appear that there would be capacity at Wood Acres ES for new students, when in fact many parents had removed their kids because of the addition project that required students to travel far out of the neighborhood that year.
Now that the Westbard sector plan has long passed, and a new set of students has entered Wood Acres, expect to hear those numbers change again.
6:20: You are how old, and you can't estimate a mile? I was doing that in high school. I would have been back inside the gym a lot sooner if I used your measurement of a mile.
It is absolutely to the supreme benefit of the developers (and their tools on the planning board and County Council) to "reduce the apparent need to build more schools."
I'll trust the numbers from both Google Maps, and my car's trip odometer, rather than your hazy memories of a gym class four decades ago, Robbie.
Why can't you provide an actual number?
OK, Robbie, I'll make it easy for you - how about a multiple-choice question?
Is the distance along Westbard Avenue between Ridgefield and Massachusetts
A) 0.1 miles
B) 0.2 miles
C) 0.3 miles
D) 0.4 miles
E) 0.5 miles
F) 0.6 miles
G) 0.7 miles
H) 0.9 miles
I) 1.0 miles
J) 1.1 miles?
Reminder: This discussion about the length of Westbard Avenue started when Dyer falsely claimed that the Westwood shopping center occupies "a one and a half block area".
6:51: Reminder: This discussion started when you lost the debate on Battery Lane AND Westbard urbanization, then went wildly off-topic after consulting your dogeared copy of "Rules for Radicals."
Don't make Hans wait all day for his dry cleaning.
6:42: Your mental illness is showing. Again.
Dyer - you could have avoided all the "Alinsky" questions by acknowledging that Westbard Avenue between Ridgefield and Massachusetts Avenue is not "one block long" - it is 1.1 miles long. If you are going to challenge that number, then provide your own number, not just make some silly statement about what you did in gym class 40 years ago.
#DodgingDyer
9:50: Now you're lying about two separate issues at once. The "block" in question is the one block between Ridgefield Rd. and the traffic light at Westbard Circle. You are now trying to claim multiple blocks of Westbard (which is three blocks between Ridgefield and Massachusetts), while also falsely claiming that the distance between Ridgefield and Mass. is over a mile long.
You earn the Alinsky label by referring to my gym class, and also falsely claiming I was in high school 40 years ago. You were, but I wasn't, Saul.
"The "block" in question is the one block between Ridgefield Rd. and the traffic light at Westbard Circle."
That "block" is 1,500 feet, 0.3 miles. That is greater than the length of Norfolk Avenue between Rugby Avenue and Woodmont Avenue, which is 1,460 feet - there are 6 blocks along that stretch of road.
If you're going to be completely inconsistent in your use of the word "block", then don't use it for describing the size of the Westwood shopping center site. That site is 25 acres, not "a block and a half area".
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