Montgomery County has proposed a road diet for Tuckerman Lane in Bethesda. The plan would reduce the road to one lane in each direction between Old Georgetown Road and Rockville Pike (MD 355). Montgomery County's Department of Transportation will hold a virtual public meeting on the road diet proposal on Wednesday, February 15, 2023 at 3:30 PM, a very unusual time for a meeting.
Make your feelings known at this meeting. To enter the meeting, use the link on the project page. You can also see the full blueprints for the new road configuration there. The County says the proposed road diet is part of its Vision Zero effort to eliminate road fatalities.
49 comments:
This all sounds Elysian; a perfect compliment to the chaos of those cursed plastic bollards now lining Old George.
Let's see if I've got this right: county spent countless millions bulldozing trees & destroying nature to build the four-lane-plus-left-turn-alley road it now plans to spend untold additional funds restricting access to, thus creating further bottlenecks and traffic jams along 355 and Old George. Rather than install a couple of pedestrian-activated traffic lights along the route, which would allow traffic to keep moving save those brief, isolated occasions when foot/bike traffic sought to cross, the county visionaries will gum up *another* route for vehicular traffic.
"Ladies, gentlemen --it has come to my attention that afternoon sunlight is blinding some of our constituents. As remedy, I propose we shift the axis of the county by 20-degrees. Now, I know some of you may suggest we investigate so-called "sun glasses," but such solutions are elitist and would do nothing to help those without ears or noses hold their glasses in place. My legislation will benefit all residents equally. Plus, the contractor has already promised an appropriate honorarium for Board members insightful enough to help pass this bill. All in favor? The bill passes without dissent."
There is no stopping those who seek only to rule rather than govern. Pathetic BS.
It's about time! This segment is rarely crowded, which of course seems to make drivers speed, with sadly several catastrophic crashes in recent years alone.
Robert,
Thank you for posting about the meeting link. Virtual of course and attendees will be masked while on Zoom from their home PC's. This is really, really insane and I am not sure how much more we can take around here. Pretty soon, they'll propose taking even more lanes out of service.
The current poles on Old Geo'twn, a state road but with support from MoCo Council, is a real disaster. The fact remains that very, very few bikes use these lanes and traffic has doubled along this corridor. Fact. They are doing another study apparently that won't be finished until summer? Shocking slow pace of govt. Where's the public hearing on this stretch? All this is predictable when nuts like Elrich are reelected albeit not very easily but still. Another busy road ruined. Thanks!
Not a bad idea with the tie in to the beltway overpass. Get rid of the retarded mess on Old Georgetown Road.
Learning
You know, if we're serious about Vision Zero and reducing roadway deaths, we need to commit to banning all conveyances, be they internal combustion engine-powered, battery-operated, scooters, bikes, wagons, ox carts. Only then can we truly achieve the fantastic, (as in "based on fantasy,") ingenuous goal of avoiding all transportation-related deaths.
Seriously? A public meeting about a temporary pilot of putting up flex posts? A public meeting for AFTER the pilot makes sense; anyone who complains before the trial period even happens is just trolling.
This section of Tuckerman always seemed disproportionately wide compared to the volume of traffic that goes through there - 4 lanes + 1 turn lane. Wonder how this will affect flow if put into effect. Probably not enough to write home about.
How about encouraging "Look Both Ways" before crossing?
I have witnessed many close calls due to pedestrians literally walking into active traffic. The crosswalks give a false sense of security.
The bike lanes on Old Georgetown Road are a travesty. The traffic caused by eliminating an entire commuter lane is ridiculous and dangerous. I've seen emergency vehicles at a standstill due to cars with nowhere to go. Yet the "safe lane" is untouched.
Can't wait for the next big snow storm when the plows will take out the bike lane experiment.
12:50: There's actually a movement afoot in the War on Cars to *encourage* pedestrians to jaywalk into the road, where drivers have no expectation of encountering them. It's already happened in some jurisdictions. Pedestrians can then legally jaywalk into oncoming traffic outside of marked crosswalks, and drivers will be liable if they hit them. Total anarchy, but the idea is to discourage more people from driving, and to that end, eventually have 10-15 MPH speed limits on every street.
@ 10:48 Anon, What in the world are you talking about? Let's remove 1 lane in each direction on the beltway then, without any meeting. No complaining until after though! Laughable comment.
I cannot attend the meeting, but I have already let tuckermanlane@montgomerycountymd.gov know my thoughts. This road already gets backed up multiple light cycles traveling NW at the Old Georgetown Road intersection at rush hour. The backups and delays during rush hour would be insane. it doesn't take a genius to figure that out. Hence, why a meeting BEFORE the implementation makes sense. Of course, we all know the meeting is just for show and this "road diet" will be forced in against everyone's will.
I loooove the bike lanes and use them.
If any of you think your input is even listened to by our County Council, much less acted upon, you haven't been paying attention.
Next up: Connecticut Ave.
(I commuted down Conn. for the last 2 weeks and I actually saw 2 cyclists - around Military Rd. area.)
After that: Democracy Blvd.
They won't stop until the whole place is shut down.
Catastrophic crashes??? Pedestrian was struck crossing the trail, pedestrian was at fault.
The county has gone mad. Reducing the roadway for the weekend spandex male warriors who are training to ride in the Tour de France??!! Come on. Is this a joke? Residents need to fight this. The disaster on Old Georgetown for a bike or two, the disaster on Little Falls Parkway, for weekend street yoga, food trucks ?? ENOUGH!!
"Laughable comment" says the guy who thinks temporary flexposts on a short span of Tuckerman is comparable to removing lanes from the beltway. God I love the internet.
State roads = Dem majority and now Dem gov. County roads = Dem majority. There's not one Republican member of MoCo Council. Since Tuckerman is a county road and they are hell bent and determined to destroy what isn't broken, your can bet this will move forward, won't ever be returned back to its current design, which is not an issue whatever, and that this is only the beginning.
5:41 - that's spot on accurate.
What’s especially funny is the vast majority of “cyclists” in the area are white males making $180K+/year. We must accommodate the white guys says the ppl who claim to hate white guys. Do ppl really not see through this yet?
Trying to see both sides of the bike lane argument, as both an avid bicyclist commuter and car owner/driver, I believe the Old Georgetown bike lanes are warranted but do question the merit of some others.
One huge problem is 355 between Grosvenor and 'Medical Center,' frankly it's amazing that such prestigious and such big taxed based neighborhoods and zip codes could build something so horrible for pedestrians and cyclists! 495 and 270 ramps, fast traffic, people coming out of the park, no sidewalks, it's screaming for serous injury. I bet it would cost upwards of 10 million buck to build a safe solution. The New bike lanes along Old Georgetown do a whole lot to make a trip between business Bethesda and 'New (North) Bethesda viable by bike or Shanks mare. The Bethesda Trolly Trail is pretty much taken over by local pedestrians and dog walkers and not so well suited for serious bikers and bike commuters.
I am sure part of the decision to install the bike lanes was the recent death of a cyclist that lost his balance and fell into the street. He was then tragically struck by a vehicle.
If you look at the site of the white painted tribute bicycle, you will see a Fire Hydrant literally in the middle on the sidewalk. I cant help but think that cyclist might have lost his balance due to that obstacle.
How is that hydrant still in place? It clearly blocks anyone in a wheelchair and causes a huge obstacle/hazard to those of us sidewalk users.
These "traffic management devices" are nothing more than a Solution in search of a Problem.
They create more confusion, more pollution and more frustration among drivers and constituents.
I feel like the design team for county roadways are running out of stuff to work on and create ridiculous solutions like the Cedar Lane Obstacle Course or the Dale Drive Slalom Course is Takoma Park.
Old drivers and new will be punished with severe rim damage or even a high center if they aren't laser focused on the pedestrian Islands in front of them.....or if there is snow or other weather.
I need to move .
They are Sooo Luxurious
"Since Tuckerman is a county road and they are hell bent and determined to destroy what isn't broken"
People are regularly struck - and repeatedly have died - along this stretch. Only a psychopath thinks the status quo "isn't broken."
5:24 - I am with you 100%. Nope, it will get worse before it gets better. Better? What exactly would that even look like? Deconstructing roadways then putting them back again as they were is a tough lift. Worse may indeed mean permanent.
Every time. I see the term “Road Diet” I am immediately reminded of the Ultra-Leftist Marc Elrich !
@12:34 - "One huge problem is 355 between Grosvenor and 'Medical Center,' frankly it's amazing that such prestigious and such big taxed based neighborhoods and zip codes could build something so horrible for pedestrians and cyclists!"
It wasn't built for cyclists! It was built long ago for cars and typical sidewalks for pedestrians. There are sidewalks on the west side along 355 from the Beltway into Bethesda where you can connect to the Cresent Trail. The sidewalks along NIH a quite wide and many bikers use them. I rarely see a biker in the traffic lanes on 355.
5:45 - Accidents are going to happen on any road and a road diet won't stop that. There's actually a very thorough study that was done that suggests that riding on the side of the road lane (sharing the road) is actually much safer than barriers, diets, white poles, etc. That road is not in fact broken and does not need to be forever changed. So, you're saying that it's actually safer for all to reduce it to very narrow lanes, one in each direction? It's just crazy and even cyclists agree. How did we get to the place we find ourselves where bikes trump cars on roads? Can't people simply exercise and enjoy bikes on the old trolley trail that runs across this stretch or the CCT which you can basically ride all the way to Mt. Vernon?
If you don’t like the plan, leave a comment and/or show up to the meeting. Also reach out to your representatives (State/County)and make sure they know how you, their constituents feel. People will react to the heat.
The Politicians I have reached out to seemed surprised that the County was moving forward even as SHA is reevaluating OGR bike lanes due to the significant blowback.
In this case, there is no chance that the county could have projections that account for the OGR bike lanes, where the Tuckerman (and Beltway on/off) have been the real problem spots that may well result in the whole thing being undone when SHA finishes.
7:17 - OMGosh! Finally, a sane and intelligent take on this. Thank you for echoing what I have been saying on all these ridiculous (and unnecessary) road destructions. Because, um, they are called roads. They aren't parks, bike paths or anything else. These were and are designed to carry automobile traffic as you rightly state. There's a study that suggests, with data, that the original "share the road" is actually safer and certainly less costly than what's been done and proposed here. Just riding a bike on the edge of the travel lane is safer. That seems like it doesn't make sense but the data bear out that it does in fact compute. This is totally, totally insane and our money is being wasted big time. Just wait for the traffic on Tuckerman. Another road to avoid now altogether.
I dare you to ride a bike from Grosvenor to Cedar Lane parallel to 355 or vice versa. We are talking about responsibly designed bike routes between two major areas. The only alternative I can see is something akin to what goes over 495 at Georgia Ave. Even then that's about a third of the length and complexity necessary...I'd say bike lanes on Old Georgetown look pretty cheap in comparison.
There are no sidewalks between cedar lane and just south of Grosvenor.
"It was built long ago for cars and typical sidewalks for pedestrians."
No, it was built long ago by Piscataway Indians, primarily for - you guessed it - pedestrian travel. Far, far more recently the route has begun to include automotive travel. Saying it "wasn't built for cyclists!" and therefore can never properly accommodate cyclists and pedestrians is ignorant and dumb.
The original Native American trail between what is now Georgetown and Rockville, followed the ridge dividing the Rock Creek valley and other watersheds to the west. Between what is now downtown Bethesda and North Bethesda, the trail followed Old Georgetown Road. The part of Wisconsin Avenue/Rockville Pike between the south end Old Georgetown Road at East-West Highway in downtown Bethesda and the north end of Old Georgetown Road north of Montrose Road in "North Bethesda", was built as a more direct route in the 19th Century. But that too was long before the age of the automobile.
If you are not a motorist, the connection across the Beltway/I-270 interchange - specifically from Pooks Hill Road to Grosvenor Lane - is nonexistent.
Tuckerman Lane west of Old Georgetown Road also existed before the age of the automobile. However Tuckerman Lane between Old Georgetown Road and Rockville Pike was not built in the early 1980s. But that is no reason why the needs pedestrians and cyclists should be ignored - there, or on any other road in our County.
Motorists can be so incredibly self-centered and inconsiderate of other peoples' transportation needs. And just plain ignorant of history.
"The crosswalks give a false sense of security." You need to go back to drivers ed. The crosswalks give legal right ot way to the pedestrians, who have the right to feel secure.
4:09 - "Motorists can be so incredibly self-centered and inconsiderate of other peoples' transportation needs."
And so can cyclists many of whom think they own the road and rarely do they stop or adhere to road signs, right of way, etc. Let's just put it this way, roads were not designed for bicycles. How about this, let's just remove lanes on every county road in the area and see what happens to the traffic. What a great idea that would be. Not.
9:31 - Gosh, I hope you're right. Whatever study SHA did was piss poor. Even Ariana Kelly, who's a Far Left nut, said she was surprised. She grew up off Old Georgetown so knows that stretch. She also said that the state has never received as many communications as they did from voters complaining about the white poles.
I guess 1:32/4:09 have never heard of The Bethesda Trolley Trail which crosses I270 and I495. Nice hike/bike path that is underutilized despite having its own bridge across the beltway.
The idiots in Rockville have decided to make commuters lives miserable in the guise of "saving lives". Funny when I'm riding on the dedicated trail along side MacArthur, so many riders choose to ride on the roadway even during low traffic times. A majority of these riders also ignore stop signs/lights as well putting the responsibility on drivers many of whom are on their phones not doing what they're supposed to be doing.
If they are closing a lane on Tuckerman, they could use Tuckerman for the Bus Rapid Transit route they are planning for this area, instead of Old Georgetown Road. The County was considering two possibilities for a BRT route from the Montgomery Mall area to the metro: OGR to the White Flint/ North Bethesda station, or Tuckerman to the Grosvenor station. It chose OGR and may expand the right-of-way for dedicated bus lanes, which involves construction, spending a lot of money, and taking land. https://www.montgomerycountymd.gov/dot-dte/projects/NorthBethesda/
So they are closing an available lane on Tuckerman, while expanding OGR. How does this make sense?
“The idiots in Rockville have decided to make commuters lives miserable”
So, pedestrians, cyclists and bus riders don’t count as “commuters”, only drivers?
Another perfect illustration of the solipsism I was describing in my previous comment.
You use the words but have no idea what they mean. Bus drivers/riders would be punished as well but closing half the roadway to what is actually a small percentage of people is nonsensical but there you are.
I'll be pulling my bike trailer today up to Aldi's in Rockville from DT Bethesda along OGR to shop and return. One more car off the road, one more happy, healthy, (relatively) safe guy.
Bethesda Trolley Trail is so much nicer but glad the majority could sacrifice for the minority today.
Too many dog walkers, fellow geriatrics, and poor etiquette walkers and runners.
It's so inconvenient to deal with some walkers so let's take 1/3 of OGR so you can get to Aldi. When you decide to be truly considerate to all people, (at least the majority), let us know.
I'm not the only one, it's Winter, too. You've killed too many along that road, it's great to not have to ride in continual fear of getting overun or cut off. Get on a bike yourself if you can handle it. Maybe you're afraid of getting hurt?
If pedestrians were not dying these changes would not be happening. Drivers are more distracted than ever because of cell phones and pedestrians keep dying. People have had years to collectively put down the cell phone, drive less distracted, and actively pay attention to the road and its potential hazards. Something has to change because drivers bad habits are not.
And just for the record, this malarkey that has been crammed down our throats that bicycles by virtue of 'being on the road' are motor vehicles is wearing thin. Bicyclists are pedestrians on bicycles. Pedal, pedestrians. foot, ped, etc. get it? No motor.
The nanosecond our one foot hits the road we are certainly pedestrians, and that transition when we dismount or even step to get off the pedals especially when brought on by errant, dangerous drivers makes our protection all.the more necessary and urgent.
What kind of idiot would consider a 25 pound self powered protection free array of tubes a motor vehicle no.matter where it's ridden?
It's ridiculous.
@ 5:56 AM - How on Earth would you use Tuckerman Lane as a substitute for bus lanes on Old Georgetown Road? Those two roads are not parallel, they are perpendicular.
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